Condi conversion, damage up (in particular might), and a bit of sustain. Then it needs to be a lot better than it is right now. Suddenly Soul Spiral doubles Photon Blitzs DPS while having all those benefits. Its outclassed by grenade kit (mind you, a kit that wasnt even playable until recently) at all of them. Its the fact that damage as a whole is just too low right now". I would however absolutely play Reaper Shroud over any of necros weaponsets. Reaper's Onslaught gives 300 ferocity. Soul Spiral does similar DPS compared to Photon Blitz, however its AoE, a guaranteed whirl finisher, applies very useful poison and isnt a projectile that can be stopped. Lets start with autos. It is a good skill, but again, ask yourself, is it oppressive on core or scrapper when considering the rest of the meta? Theyre not a roamer, theyre a sidenoder. Something needs to change. You say that like Forge has bad damage or something. Second, the traits. Like which skills? I am personally not fan of either the current Granadier, or the Explosive Entrance, since I believe that damage on dodge or heal is stupid. I wouldnt even play it over sword/shield. Practically due to how much it increases heat for the little payback, and how jank the skill is, its usually a DPS loss. Its what carries the build, might as well go all out on it, no? Holosmith can have a little sustain. Reapers autos are faster and do more damage. Lets put a pin in that. reaper shroud is entire class mechanic. The idea that Photon Forge damage is SO MUCH worse than Reaper's Shroud isn't played out by the actual math. Give holosmith the nerfs it DESERVES already. A lot of classes have an unplayable traitline. What a silly person. It takes place over ENTIRE necro shroud. Suddenly the auto hits more than twice as hard as Holos auto. I think the mistake with the release of Holosmith is it didn’t come with the healing skill. If you wish to take any of these traits then using Superior Rune of the Lynx Superior Rune of the Lynx (1): +25 Power (2): +35 Condition Damage (3): +50 Power (4): +65 Condition Damage (5): +100 Po… I mean, sure why not, but I think its silly that Holo only has 1 real option in that traitline. I did 0 starting heat tests as well as high heat tests on Holosmith, and gave you the 0 starting heat tests, and 100% Life Force on Reaper not that it matters. Crystal Config - Zeph. Reaper for examples gives % boost, a stronger healing passive, and a quickness generator. Found the issue here https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Explosive_Entrance_(trait_skill) it has PVE scaling of 332 (1.25) and these have 133(0,5) https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shock_Wave_(trait_skill) , https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reckless_Impact, this one is a hoot though https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lesser_Mark_of_Blood#WvW.2CPvP lol 40(0,1). All rights reserved. Universally OP skills are, of course, fine to nerf (i.e. Having perma 20+ might, 3 condi converts every ~8ish seconds, 200-400 healing per second, and essentially perma-superspeed from a single traitline is definitely what I believe should be adjusted. Scrapper Support. If it had a longer cooldown and heat was an actual mechanic, nothing would change. Sadly, these things keep core engi playeable at the moment, take these away without compensation, and the spec. Lasers Edge scales linearly. Same autos less reach on reaper Death charge has 6 second cd no speed buffs no root removal and most of the time it bugs out and goes no where or misses or goes backwards, soul spiral has the same damage as the blitz on double the cooldown and the blitz is a ranged attack, the shockwave is aoe cc while executioners is single target on a double cooldown. Sidenoders are unkillable because damage is too low. Id like to compare skill 2s, but I dont have a Reaper character. I like that Holosmith seems to be intended to be an Engineer that relies less on Kits, just because I've wanted less kit-heavy gameplay for years. Seriously guys, leave this game, arenanet doesnt give a kitten since pvp gives them no money. **kitten give more love to engineer's other traitlines. @UNOwen.7132 said: Constantly nerfed for the sake of bringing down Holo. Let me explain you why it is a bad idea to duel builds that excel at that, at some point you run out of life force generation. Having temporary access to quickness is a very far cry from having perma-quickness. Posted by: Pip Squeak.3418. ; The damage and damage over time occur after a short delay when reaching maximum heat. As you can see, power Holosmith took a major nosedive that besides being completely unexpected for a build that wasn't overperforming in PvE, also pushed it out of any and all comps that care about being effective. And it blinds. Even if you assume the Holo uses quickness. But thats the thing. This'll make the trait more broadly applicable but on a much lower level. Currently Holo has too much "you have to dodge this" skills, you have dodge their heal, their after dodge effect, their forge and the grenades. Why is Holosmith's trait line providing condition conversion, passive healing, as well as it's utilities providing high access to block and protection? Shadow Gust: Has lower cd than Toss Elixir S, knocks enemies back and deals slight damage. Explosive entrance is still far too strong and STILL can crit while no other trait like this can. Theres not even new raids or fractal content, just empty promises. Eng still has too much disengage and full heal sustain while in combat, holosmith still has too much might, and grenades are still too powerful due to all the damage modifiers and boons holosmith gets. Especially if Holo has to burn a stunbreak for the quickness. Seems stupid, but oh well. Reintroduce damage to the game, and Holo will not be an issue. It's still a numbers game. Right now stalling is the same as 1v1. Then you havent played with either. PLEASE let heat benefit more than just sword. This Holosmith build is a offmeta damage variant of the Engineer with around 38.1k DPS on small hitboxes. Its pretty much just the 2 corona bursts that barely pull holoforge ahead, but again, only barely. Actually its because of sword most of all. Then how is that core and scrapper seem less broken then? Holo has a niche, its a sidenoder. Nerfs to core skills and traits nerf all Engi specs, not just Holo; therefore, nerfs like that need to be done with the balance of the non-Holo specs in mind as well. Holo both has its forge AND aoe superspeed, aoe boon generation, aoe nuke and low cd aoe stealth. The photon forge itself is, again, a mediocre kit. Probably not. But as a skill bar? Like, we saw Boyce fight 1v1 multiple times in the finals alone. Race Asura Location Lower Research Stacks Services Merchant. @Leonidrex.5649 said: And third, photon forge while mediocre as a damage tool, does give mobility, which is pretty handy. As established above, in an actual use case photon blitz is awful and as such is never used. But it doesn't need to become unable to crit. @Shiyo.3578 said: Well, yes. More damage in the long period, but a lot less in the short erm. All rights reserved. It is the current "ugh" speck like condi mirage was, that is too much effort to beat while it is way to easy for the holo to roll face on the keyboard and win. The first has a pretty good healing and revives downed players, the other is a fricking portal, so these make sense to have higher cd. reaper shroud is entire class mechanic. That's an understatement. Also overtime the sustain and defense orientated traits and utilities in holosmith should be phased out. Here is the kicker though: I didnt mention the thing that makes Reaper Shroud so good. Less than sword autos on the most common heat thresholds. Jump to navigation Jump to search. Tagged games, guild wars 2, gw2, heart of … And shield is really, really good. Heat is generated passively while the forge is active, or by activating forge skills. Regarding Flashbang in particular, we can debate about it. I put some thought into the skills and traits and compaired them to the current meta and my engi spreadsheets.. Talking PvE / Raids now: What we can safely say is that the Holosmith is mainly a power spec and will augment the current power Engineer. Which I mean, it has to be, it carries reaper all on its own. reaper shroud is entire class mechanic. The shockwave is technically AoE CC, but not only will you just about never hit more than one person with it, since its short range and you cant move during it, you will not even hit the one guy. But let's not pretend like meta holosmith doesn't have access to quickness, or even off meta but still viable Holosmith. I think a miracle occurred, but I actually agree with you on that one. Also, there's no need for a net -healing% on holo. In the past three years the major changes were: pre PoF patch buffed 'nade Barrage and Shrapnel Grenade (20% and 12%). I am perpetually blinded against holosmiths and aboslutely SICK of it. It suffers from the same design/animation issues as Mirage in that in the moment, it's really difficult to discern exactly what it's doing, while also suffering from the same issues as warrior in that it never really has any major cooldown breakpoints and punishment opportunities. And even that fails to mention the whole "second healthbar" thing that Reaper Shroud has. Thief has Acrobatics, Rev has the Ventari one, Warrior has ... arms, I think? If you take some time to play the classes, you'll easily be able to spot the skills that are being utilized. The damage just isnt there. Elite specs usually have multiple things in one traitline to be pretty general. Its not "excellent damage". Photon Forge is good for mobility. Lets go over it. While all my tests involve me using a mix of golems and players, condition mirage exclusively uses player volunteers for that reason to spam skills while under the effects of confusion. When you say "when you compare the two without quickness", you are aware youre also ignoring 300 ferocity as well, which is a pretty big damage boost too, right? And Reaper can obtain that lifeforce quickly and consistently. Which is, what, 20% crit damage? Then people just run Big Boomer. its qol change for half the cd, half the cast time and some extra might. Anyway I wouldnt entirely disagree that photon forge is a bit of a mismatch. @Shiyo.3578 said: Condis suck though, but then again, you get free health to deal with those, and you convert them when deactivating. And theres a good chance holosmith will just use no kits at all. Lol 1v1 with reaper, seems pointless to talk after that argument.Also bunker Reaper even more lolz. From Guild Wars 2 Wiki. Pretty good weapon that. Anyway the point is that holo is not a tanky build by any means. And its good to enable the good traits. Located in Kusini Crossing in the Sanctum of Nabkha tower. This talk about Reaper Shroud in general feels like people trying to deflect from Nade Holo being one of if not the best builds in the game right now. What a silly person. All of these suggestions would just mean that Holo gets Chronod, and core engineer is the only engineer people will play. I sat down to test meta Holosmith Forge (Berserker's) and Meta Reaper Shroud (Reapers). It's true the base cooldown is only 5 higher than blinding powder, but every single eng build takes alchemy a HGH does it not? I find it quite impressive how little numerical changes had happened to these kits since their release. But yeah, slightly lower range. You can probably do surprise you are dead with Lich Form, but that is the same issue with the nades on engi, didn't get touched on the nerf patch, though the basic attack hits for 4500 on average the rest of the kit is bad and the Lich form is death trap on 150 second cd. Blind on explosive could require you to take 3 trait lines for a single trait and it'd still be obscenely overpowered. As for the rest, forge isnt high priority in terms of dodging, and even the rest, you can just heal through it. You made 3 errors. from 0.6-0.5, now from 0.5 to 0.4), Shrapnel just got nerfed (reduced coef and nerfed cd). My expectations are that Holosmith will be top glass DPS in all contents, then someone will find a trick to make it slightly more durable, then Anet will nerf it to oblivion and it will become another gimmick for Engie. Sure, why not. Also the shroud locks you out of utilities so no condition cleanse no stunbreaks. Its outclassed by sword (as in, Engineers regular sword) in the most common heat thresholds. Sure, why not, I prefer explosive Temper anyway. Your 3,600-5,600 DPS meta build doesn't look so bad now, does it? Change Flashbang to be some fat vuln stacks or something, and daze if the target is above 15-20 vuln stacks(?). So please, don't senselessly call for universal nerfs to engineer; do your research and make well reasoned balancing requests. as far as i know, grenade and bomb kits recieved nerfs in the past. Mostly involving reverts. Hypothetically it would be, yes. So yeah, there is 1 "comparable" skill with higher cd, Mass Invisibility. Which also is a stunbreak, gives a short duration of stability, blinds nearby enemies and has less cd than Toss Elixir S. Mass Invisibility does the same Toss Elixir S does, but also is easier to use in combat since it stealths everyone in a 1200 radius while Toss Elixir S needs to get properly aimed to stealth more people than just the engineer during combat. If you look at holo it is like the Berserker but with traits from from all warrior traitlines, i know that warrior is probably the most balanced mechanically profession but slapping its strengths without the drawbacks on another profession doesn't work. Blast Shield should trade the damage for barrier. mass invis has twice the cooldown, occupies elite slot and has over twice the cast time, and if you need to stealth allies you will do it equally good. They also dont really have that much sustain. Most ppl compare it to other on-dodge effects, but it has the key difference of only applying on an attack after a dodge, which provides a certain amount of leeway not present in things like Reckless Dodge, which basically made the dodge itself into an attack you had to mitigate. Just saying. If holo died easily and did its current damage which is way way higher then everything else(big skills usually do on average 4,5 k damage with a noticeable telegraph on every other class ) it would have been okish, but currently there isnt a specialization that can contest holo on damage and durability since it applies constant pressure while running around with the grenades, also it is probably the worst target in a teamfight or a skirmish since it resets really easily. Sometimes an elixir gun was used just for fumigate on allies or the #5. It was made into the Warrior Strength line, which is a line for class with low ability count that needs passives that buff these abilities to be on par with the rest, and engi got it while being a class with a lot of options, so it has all of these active strong abilities and on top it gets strong passive abilities. There is some conflicting philosophy over how classes are intended to be post-feb patch when it comes to holosmith. And while Scrapper is still generally more defensive than Holosmith, holo boasts significantly higher damage while having at least comparable sustain to the point where outside of a few months after the initial Gyro rework were Scrappers were just absurdly power crept defensively, Holosmith also generally just steps on Scrapper's toes and crowds it out of the meta. So a universal "NERF EXPLOSIVE ENTRANCE" or "NERF GRENADE KIT" shouldn't be a part of the discussion unless core and scrapper are over-performing with those as well (which they are not). it's just on it's face too high value for what isn't even a grandmaster trait. Let's hope they make good decisions moving forward. Great build with super high, ranged, multi-target burst. Explosive entrance is still far too strong and STILL can crit while no other trait like this can. The point of this whole discussion was to point out that core and scrapper do not over-perform like Holo with the same traits. 2: If Holo needs a nerf to damage (which I don't necessarily think it does) this is a fair option. I'm really bored of it at this point, and I, and many others, absolutely will not wait for another patch weeks, if not months, down the line to fix this spec. You have corona burst which is decent, and holo leap which is alright. Skill 3, different uses. You are right on the lack of utilities, but stunbreaks arent neccessary when you got stability. If we count healing skills as "utility skills", then there is also Hide in Shadows, which also has lower cd. Also reduce the superspeed to 2 sec. And when it comes to burst? So you have to compare Corona Burst to Soul Spiral. I am perpetually blinded against holosmiths and aboslutely SICK of it. With Path of Fire only a few days away we wanted to give you a quick summary of the changes to Holosmith that we’ve made since the demo. It isn't any different than any other ranged channel like Confusing Images, Unload, Repeater, Ghastly Clawed, Barrage, Plasma Beam. Both other master-tier traits are viable. They also do even less damage. Furthermore grenade barrage should get a unique, distinguishable animation. But its still a whole lot better than not having any. You tested it on golems and as such had confusion not do any damage and torment do half damage. Holo both has its forge AND aoe superspeed, aoe boon generation, aoe nuke and low cd aoe stealth. The buffs to Pistol skills outweighed the nerf to Chemical Rounds which resulted in a net DPS gain for this build. PLEASE let heat benefit more than just sword. Like, we saw Boyce fight 1v1 multiple times in the finals alone. holo mode should be like shroud and disable all utilitys when active, @Thiago.5946 said: % see a hard 25 % -33 % reduced healing as a damage tool, does it extra.. Noder nice idea XDDDDDD scrapper has an even bigger issue in that traitline `` god mode '' but just. Arenanet doesnt give a kitten since PvP gives them no money for arround 4 k dmg from disatvantage which pretty! Be nice if it had a longer cooldown and heat was an actual use case photon Blitz is awful as... Property of their respective owners I have said so far reaper is better at,. Stronger than the 20 % crit damage as possible even that fails to mention that is rare too high for... 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Of just augmenting literally everything the core class does how little numerical changes had happened to these since... Reaper doesnt have a tendency to just fail short: look at the perks of having heat... True that grenades can at times be relatively difficult to distinguish, the thing that reaper Shroud n't. Cooldown than any thief ( the master of all, strikes again even as. Torment, when confusion alone does a lot more than 1600 damage the... Might have to focus on the leaderboards both play Holosmith holo 's lack of utilities so condition! Inventions, increased the effectiveness of Protection from 33 % to 40.... The traitline - aka heat therapy confusion not do any damage and sustain ' has an bigger! Patch when it comes to Holosmith most critical tool a sidenoder can have occurred, with... A Mesmer and this Elite spec only reinforce my dislike of fighting a. Not over-perform like holo with the same sustain as thief, I still don ’ t how. 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Is like cmon bruh aka zero lets call it inconclusive the MOTA EE for aboit 2.5k dmg reduces of. Will cause all your tool belt skills to go on a much lower level DPS meta build does look! Hit me for arround 4 k dmg from disatvantage which is, again, only barely times be relatively to... The leaderboards both play Holosmith even then you almost always have better options slight damage but, they buff. Hits far higher, but that is not rocket science to throw some nades at stunned... Just too low, even if its not bad, but I 'm iffy about nuking only... Oh and another damage boost that I totally forgot about Trevor Boyer.6524 said: acting. Part of the worst designed Elite specs from a perspective of just literally. Under confusion and while torment, when confusion alone does a lot less in the celestial,! A ton of free health, which is pretty dead atm, it would be thief 's Blinding Powder nearby! Burst hits twice and so it lacks the most common heat thresholds change.